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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

We know that Hordlings are "born" from larvae (usually, at least), quite much like fiends on other planes are.

We know that Night Hags herd larvae, using them as trading stock and evil planar currency.

What we don't know is, what Night Hags think about Hordlings, how they are connected with them, why the hell they ever began herding larvae, if they like, dislike, love or hate Hordlings, and what Hordlings think about them.

There've been some suggestions in other threads, but I'd like to discuss this over here, so this discussion doesn't get drowned in all those other topics Eye-wink

For this particular topic, I'd say we leave things open in the official books that we'll release, rather giving only hints, legends and opinions, which may all be contradictory. Let's leave the final decision to the individual DM himself.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Little idea to throw in: Some Hordlings (some Hordes?) might consider Night Hags (the race or certain individuals) to be "mommy" ...

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I have allways had impression that hordlings don´t bother hags much and vice wersa. True, larvae that turn ito hordlings is bad for buisnes and represent lost profit. But it seems that Hags would have done something about it allready.

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Little idea to throw in: Some Hordlings (some Hordes?) might consider Night Hags (the race or certain individuals) to be "mommy" ...

Maybe Hags assisted Yugoloths in creation of Hordlings, so from that there would be explained hordling affection for hags (another reason why Yugoloths were displeased by Hordlings, after all you dont want slaverace that serves 2 masters).

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

'Squaff' wrote:
I have allways had impression that hordlings don´t bother hags much and vice wersa. True, larvae that turn ito hordlings is bad for buisnes and represent lost profit. But it seems that Hags would have done something about it allready.

Dito.

big hordes might be a threat to a Night Hag. but i imagine a Night Hag whichs "garden" is being desolated by a few Hordlings would turn them off like roaming dogs: "Hush, hush, get out! Get out! Not the carnivore tulips! Stupid Hordy!"

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I love this image Smiling

Any artist interested in turning this into a picture?

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Some Night Hags use weaker hordeling as cattle, ingredients for potions, pets, alternate food sources, and furniture. Literally, hordelings are--for the Night Hags--a constantly renewable resource.

Since very little grows on the Gray Wastes, the bones of Hordelings provide an excellent source of wood (bones), sustenance (Hordeling burgers! =d), amusement (hordeling fights--like cock fights!), and everything else you can imagine.

This, of course, does not apply to the really big nasty Hordelings. But in general, I imagine the relationship being very mercantile; some Hordelings may even peddle their smaller, weaker brethren to the hags in exchange for favors, currency, secrets, whatever.

There are probably--in fact, definitely--some hags who keep Hordelings as familiars or pets, or guard-dogs, or whatever. Some Hordelings may even be slavishly obedient to these gray sisters so long as the gray sisters treat them well and feed them (just like any pet owner, some may be savagely beaten and turned into the equivalent of junkyard dogs).

'Wild' hordelings are both a nuisance and a serious danger, depending on their number and power. If a large enough group of smaller hordelings gather together, they can do some serious damage--and very quickly. For this reason, the Night-Hags do their best to scatter and cull the numbers, but it's a hard job and requires constant vigilance, because Hordelings give rabbits a run for the money when it comes to being prolific. Hags may even hire passing-by adventurers to cull the numbers a bit for them.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Heh heh. That last bit about Hags with Hordeling pets made me think of a less intelligent than average Night Hag with a Smarter than average Hordeling slave/pet that looks fairly unimpressive. The little guy is basically forcing the Hag to do its bidding by outsmarting her and convincing her that all these things were really her ideas. The question is, what would a Hordeling make a Hag research/create/destroy/spy on for it?

Kay
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'Hymneth' wrote:
Heh heh. That last bit about Hags with Hordeling pets made me think of a less intelligent than average Night Hag with a Smarter than average Hordeling slave/pet that looks fairly unimpressive. The little guy is basically forcing the Hag to do its bidding by outsmarting her and convincing her that all these things were really her ideas. The question is, what would a Hordeling make a Hag research/create/destroy/spy on for it?

Something to eat. Oh, well, I guess I've been a bit single-minded when it somes to Hordlings. Always eating and killing and such.

Also, I like all this pet stuff. Only it would be more efficient to use Hordelings or their excremetns as dung to raise trees.. and not burn their bones. Eye-wink

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Also, I like all this pet stuff. Only it would be more efficient to use Hordelings or their excremetns as dung to raise trees.. and not burn their bones. Eye-wink

I imagine most trees can't grow in the Gray Wastes. It's not that there's nothing for the trees to live off of; the sheer palpable aura of despair just makes any plant-life that doesn't feed off of gloom (see: Gloomweed) incapable of growing.

The Lurklings provide a constant, renewable, cheap, easily accessible source of building material, food, and labor. I really find the idea that the entire plane's ecology, economy, and even architecture is constructed around them fascinating--after all, why go through the trouble of growing trees and orchids when you can just slaughter a pack of lurklings for all the material and fire fuel you'll ever need? It makes the larva all the more valuable, too--in a pinch, they can be converted to lurklings, which through some alchemical procedure can be processed into mortar, bricks, or other building material.

It makes the hags more important, too--after all, the hags are the ones who know the processes by which lurkling corpses can be converted into edible food, building material, or burnable flame. It's not just something anyone can do--maybe some of the knowledge seeps out into general native knowledge (I imagine they'd need to know a little of this, just to survive), but in general it's the hags who run all the industry of the plane and hock their wares to those who are traveling through (often in exchange for larva, which are more valuable to them).

It really makes the hag's relationship with the lurklings (and furthermore, the hordelings) interesting, too--after all, without the lurklings, the hags would have trouble turning a profit or producing materials for their various industries. I imagine they have an almost affectionate relationship with many lurkings, while simultaneously shoveling countless atrocities and horrors upon their race--cooing softly to a quivering lurkling and relaxing it with pets and soothing scratches before dumping it into a boiling cauldron, whistling cheerfully while it screams. But again, a keynote of this relationship is that it's the LURKLINGS who are at the bottom of the ladder--not the Hordelings in general (who probably treat the lurklings much the same).

Kay
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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

You are really full of ideas, aren't you? Smiling

Sooo..

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The Lurklings provide a constant, renewable, cheap, easily accessible source of building material, food, and labor. I really find the idea that the entire plane's ecology, economy, and even architecture is constructed around them fascinating
Me too! But I really won't say things like "entire plane" so easily, so I'd show a bit restriction and say "some of areas of The Waste". Then, it is a really, really nice idea. Compare this to the following:

I *think* there is a layer or something of The Waste that is really full of forests and trees and such. Like that one Armoury99 thought out. So there *are* things that grow pretty well here. Only, what growth, lives and lurks in The Nadir is rather.. nasty. But you can still use them as firewood. That is, if one needs such a thing.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Sorry if I come across as pushy sometimes--I just spit ideas out by the hundreds, so sometimes it sounds like I'm pulling a 'my-way-or-the-highway' thing. I always expect people to just comb through my giant blurbs and basically just pull out the good parts from the bad.

Quote:
I *think* there is a layer or something of The Waste that is really full of forests and trees and such. Like that one Armoury99 thought out. So there *are* things that grow pretty well here. Only, what growth, lives and lurks in The Nadir is rather.. nasty. But you can still use them as firewood. That is, if one needs such a thing.

Good point; the lurklings make great firewood for the parts in the plane where there aren't trees or plants growing. And of course the plane does have native fauna--it's just gotta be either really robust or manage to feast off of the apathy and gloom to survive.

Infact, some lurklings might even be trees.

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'The Great Hippo' wrote:
Infact, some lurklings might even be trees.

Just.. lol. That's pretty cool. Mh, maybe the Lurkies just "grow" or "mutate" to something that fits the place they or other Lurklings have been around for some time (say, a few hundred to thousand years). Maybe they even reproduce occasionally as.. what they currently are (fish or trees, but its really rare). Evolution gone creepy. They may even (could be) turn(ed) into Hordelings. Could be a funny alternative to the caste-system of the other fiendish races. Then, of course, forgot about that crippled-Hordeling rubbish.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Nighthags may, in fact, get to determine much of a lurkling's progress. This entwines Nighthags even more with lurklings; perhaps, through various alchemical processes, nighthags can convert larva into a lurkling with specific features that they want. This allows nighthags to make lurklings who will serve as able-bodied guard-dogs, or trees with poisonous fruit (and each fruit has nasty, nasty teeth), or even tentacled horrors to guard the stairs down into their basement.

Edit: One alternate possibility--or maybe it's a dark that no one has confirmed--is that the night hags are responsible for lurklings. Not even the Hordelings know this, and if they did, they'd be pissed as hell for the most part--it would mean that the Night Hags have been hamstringing their race for countless centuries by snatching up larva who would potentially become powerful hordelings, robbing them of their identity, and converting them into pretty powerless lurklings for the Night Hag's own purposes.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Yep, as mentioned the second and third layers have plenty of trees (I think it's mostly fir's on the second and olives on the third). In fact there's a town on the 2nd layer made completely out of wood that constantly oozes a blood-like sap which protects it's inhabitants from the fade.

Having said that using lurklings as a renewable resource sounds like a great idea, they just don't have to be the only resource. I also have vague memories of larve, petitioners and undead being used as building materials in various parts of the lower planes.

Oh, and lets not forget the city of man on the third layer which is made up of it's inhabitants.

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Oh, and lets not forget the city of man on the third layer which is made up of it's inhabitants.

That sounds awesome.

Man, I need to actually sit down and buy some real Planescape supplements.

I'm literally just functioning off of hearsay and the seat of my pants, here.

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It's in planes on conflict I think and yeah it's pretty cool. Great place to live if you become part of the brain, not so good if you're a cobblestone or urinal.

I'm assuming the city at the centre of the 3 wastes is going to come up at some point in this project too.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

'The Great Hippo' wrote:
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Oh, and lets not forget the city of man on the third layer which is made up of it's inhabitants.

That sounds awesome.

Man, I need to actually sit down and buy some real Planescape supplements.

I'm literally just functioning off of hearsay and the seat of my pants, here.

I shall discourage you on that, unless your house stands on golden pillars. (for example In the Cage costs >100€ on amazon germany).

To be not completely offT: Let's make the woods a bit more.. diversiefied, yes? "Woods like in Ancient Greece" or so is less boring than "Mostly Olive Trees".

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'Kay' wrote:
I shall discourage you on that, unless your house stands on golden pillars. (for example In the Cage costs >100€ on amazon germany).

To be not completely offT: Let's make the woods a bit more.. diversiefied, yes? "Woods like in Ancient Greece" or so is less boring than "Mostly Olive Trees".

Yeah, I suppose there's got to be at least one Pomegranate Laughing out loud .

Oh, and I bought all my source material as PDF's I bought every source book published for PS and Dark Sun for a couple of hundred

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Wheeee... I've got troubling coming along with you guys. The amount of material and ideas you post here is - enormous.

First off, I love the Lurkling ideas, and it's got GREAT potential of tying the Night Hags with Hordlings in a wonderful (evil-kind-of-wonderful) way.
I especially like the idea that Night Hags kinda "force" larvae to become Lurklings, while without their interference, those larvae would have had a chance to turn into real Hordlings one day. It fits the Night Hag behaviour so well. Smiling

I especially love the idea of Lurklings being pets for Night Hags.

And what I love even more is the idea of Lurklings (or Lurkling-appearing-Hordlings - even Night Hags make mistakes sometimes...) using Night Hags to their own ends, while *appearing* as their pets.

My major problem right now is, there's been so much material since yesterday, I don't know how to summarize and collect all of it in one place. I really lost a bit of the overall view and I'm not sure anymore what the Hordlings are really going to become in this project.

While this is a fascinating moment indeed Smiling , it's not exactly good when that happens to a project leader Eye-wink

I don't know how much time I'll have today, but I'll try organizing more of the new material as soon as possible...

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I've summarized most stuff now in the "Important Discussion"-thread about Hordlings. I haven't included the "Lurklings as currency & resource"-theme yet, but I'll add that soon.

Furthermore, I had another idea for the connection of Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings.

It's said that Hordlings are stuck in their shape, their bodies the "turned inside-out" expression of their inner evil.

But what if a Hordling's nature truly changes, if he/she/it/whatever really turns into something else?

In that case, a Hordling can transform back into a larva again. The Hordling dissolves/destroys/pupates its body, and returns to the beginning of things (from its own perspective). The next time it breaks out of the larva shell, it might be something way stronger than before, but sometimes it's really just different, a shape fitting their nature again.

Of course, this makes Night Hags way more important to Hordlings. The crones can be dangerous to the Hordlings, selling them off to baatezu or tanar'ri, or using them for their own ends. But - and here things really get interesting - the Night Hags can also protect the larva.

Those Hordlings that feel they are about to return to larva status need the Night Hags. Even the really, really powerful ones.

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'joyblood' wrote:
Those Hordlings that feel they are about to return to larva status need the Night Hags. Even the really, really powerful ones.

This would definitely inject a new dynamic to the hag/hordling relationship, especially those who seem to work for/be kept as pets by the Grey Sisters. Despite rage, cruelty, and callousness both sides would have a reason to cooperate with each other - if you even need a reason other than 'Yugoloths' Smiling

I've been quiet these last few weeks, but I'll try to get more involved again... great work so far everyone!

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

And here's my take on how Hordlings see the Night Hags...

Night Hags herd the larvae, taking control of their existence.

They sell them off to tanar'ri, baatezu, liches and so on, or they force them out of their shells before time to create Lurklings.

And they protect them, if they have a reason to.

Hordlings seek to be independent, living out their rage and simply being what they are - their "inside-out" bodies show that quite clearly.

To them, being shipped off to another plane to be forced into a different race is the ultimate horror. Being forced to become a Lurkling sure is, too. Death by being consumed by lich might still be the best alternative, except for actually turning into a True Hordling one day.

Put short, Night Hags are the embodied nightmares for every Hordling. And things get only worse when they come into a situation where they need the hags.

Some Hordlings try to shake off the horror by simply giving up, by not caring about the nightmare anymore. Others try to overcome the horror by allying with it - they become pets, slaves or even partners of the hags. Of course, in the long run, that usually works - for Night Hags seem to want to be the embodied nightmares of Hordlings (and, actually, everyone else). Or... maybe they don't want to. Maybe they are.

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'joyblood' wrote:
But what if a Hordling's nature truly changes, if he/she/it/whatever really turns into something else?

Hmmm, 'What can change the nature of a Hordling?' Laughing out loud

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

*lol*

Cool

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I absolutely adore the idea that re-pupating Hordelings sometimes must rely on the Night Hags for protection, and that Hordelings go through some sort of chrysalis stage when they change enough (kind of like insects shedding off its skin), reverting to larva and re-emerging as something else. This might be a better alternative to my 'Eat-Another-Hordeling' evolution idea (although I still love the image of Hordelings just eating Lurklings to regain hitpoints).

One thing, though--I think that though the hags definitely turn potential Hordelings into lurklings (and even control what form they take for their own maligned purposes), lurklings do occur naturally as well. The Hags might be responsible for the first lurklings (this would be an optional dark, of course), but they aren't responsible for the countless lurklings that pop up on the plane--not anymore, anyway. This is important because there are just so damn many lurklings, the hags could never produce them all.

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'The Great Hippo' wrote:
This might be a better alternative to my 'Eat-Another-Hordeling' evolution idea (although I still love the image of Hordelings just eating Lurklings to regain hitpoints).

This I like! Regaining strength through eating others, maybe even extra strength for some time, or even attaching an extra limb on their body for some time, but nothing related to personal evolution.

'The Great Hippo' wrote:
One thing, though--I think that though the hags definitely turn potential Hordelings into lurklings (and even control what form they take for their own maligned purposes), lurklings do occur naturally as well.

Yes, I agree on that, and I think I've also written that somewhere, haven't I? If not, I'll add Smiling

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It could still be for personal evolution, just at a very high risk of the 'evolving' hordeling's individuality. Thus, it is rarely undertaken unless at dire need. Any more than, say, three such lurkling grafts at a time threatens to overwhelm the hordeling's ego. To put more on safely, one must be taken off.

Also, just to poke fun at how similar these guys are becoming to the Zerg, since there are hordelings of all imaginable shapes and sizes, do you think there are hordeling buildings? Perhaps entire towns of squishy flesh and tooth filled doors that produces some very interesting enzymes that can be imbibed as potions for augmenting the body. These buildings are deadly for anyone but other hordelings to enter, although one with sufficient power or the proper knowledge can hold the maw open and not be digested as they collect the juices inside.

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I still like the idea of Hordeling evolution through the consumption of darklings and other Hordelings, but there are immense problems just from a game-playing perspective. That said, I think the Chrysalis option is a lot more viable mechanics-wise, and makes just as much sense.

It might be possible to turn lurklings into permanent grafts to Hordelings (and mortals), but it requires the intercession of a hag/certain alchemical processes/a unique situation/whatever.

It's very tempting for me to go further with what you're suggesting (Iavas) with the lurklings being attached like socketed gems in Diablo or Transformers ("I need Gills! I need claws!" *snag, snag* "Okay, don't need them any more" *shed*), and as cool of an idea as it strikes me as, it'd probably be an agonizing pain to implement, mechanically. That being said:

The idea of a Hordeling becoming a house strikes me as perfectly fitting for Hordelings. It'd just be one Hordeling, mind you--a unique permutation of Hordelings, as always--but the first idea that came to mind when you suggested that is a sugary sweet Hordeling that became a gingerbread-like house (with nasty, nasty hidden teeth).

And of course, who else would live in it besides a Night Hag?

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It could still be for personal evolution, just at a very high risk of the 'evolving' hordeling's individuality.

I see this a bit critical for the mere reason that it's hard to explain old canon this way. If hordlings would actually use other hordlings body parts to actually evolve (not just "add a limb for some time"), it's highly improbable that greybeards actually believed Hordlings are stuck all the time.

Quote:
Also, just to poke fun at how similar these guys are becoming to the Zerg, since there are hordelings of all imaginable shapes and sizes, do you think there are hordeling buildings?

Definitely yes. It'd probably be an exception, but WHEN it fits an evil guy's nature to look just like that....

Think "evil world-conquering master-architect"... or something Eye-wink

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The idea of a Hordeling becoming a house strikes me as perfectly fitting for Hordelings. It'd just be one Hordeling, mind you--a unique permutation of Hordelings, as always--but the first idea that came to mind when you suggested that is a sugary sweet Hordeling that became a gingerbread-like house (with nasty, nasty hidden teeth).

And of course, who else would live in it besides a Night Hag?

Oh, powers.

Did I mention I love you people? Laughing out loud

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Okay, I think I was misunderstood. I am against permanent evolution as you are, joyblood. I'm talking about temporary grafts that can be removed and turned back into autonimous lurklings. And Hippo, while statwise it might be a pain, since only other hordelings can do this and it is unlikely that a PC will be a hordeling, you don't actually need to write exact rules for this process. It's more flavour text - "You see the large, heavily built hordeling in front of you charge through the horde directly towards you. Without pausing, it snatches up a spikey looking lurkling and rams it onto its head, turning it into a bony horn and making its charge seem that much deadlier."

Also, about the houses thing, I want to direct your attention to page 91 of Faces of Evil. There is chant of a village of hordelings that have managed to overcome their hatereds and are trying to fight both the despair of the plane and their own evil natures. As perfect a place for slimy toothy buildings (or gingerbread houses) as you ever could want, no?

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'Iavas' wrote:
Okay, I think I was misunderstood. I am against permanent evolution as you are, joyblood. I'm talking about temporary grafts that can be removed and turned back into autonimous lurklings. And Hippo, while statwise it might be a pain, since only other hordelings can do this and it is unlikely that a PC will be a hordeling, you don't actually need to write exact rules for this process. It's more flavour text - "You see the large, heavily built hordeling in front of you charge through the horde directly towards you. Without pausing, it snatches up a spikey looking lurkling and rams it onto its head, turning it into a bony horn and making its charge seem that much deadlier."

I never saw the used Lurkling as surviving the process.

This way... I love it. Laughing out loud

And, considering game-mechanics, it's really quite easy: An opposed check of some kind for the two Hordlings, and if the "attacker" wins, he can use as many limbs, special powers, .... as he has hit dice.

'Iavas' wrote:
Also, about the houses thing, I want to direct your attention to page 91 of Faces of Evil. There is chant of a village of hordelings that have managed to overcome their hatereds and are trying to fight both the despair of the plane and their own evil natures. As perfect a place for slimy toothy buildings (or gingerbread houses) as you ever could want, no?

Anyone interested in detailling that city???

Of course, "trying to overcome" doesn't mean they already succeeded....

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I picture that city as being fairly small, no more than maybe 100 hordelings. There are perhaps 3 or 4 relatively powerful and intelligent hordelings running the show, and they are genuinely trying to be nice and push aside their nature. Out of the rest of the group, maybe 50% sort of understand the concept and are trying, another 30% aren't intelligent enough to know what it means and are just along for the ride, and the rest are playing along until something better comes along.

I have this image of Hordelings wandering around with crudely drawn instruction books, trying to remember if they're supposed to greet visitors or eat them, which kinds of bodily expulsions are appropriate, and whether it's better to kill or maim.

The buildings could be a random hodgepodge of normal houses, houses built of bone or flesh, living houses, houses that look right, but aren't put together in anything resembling the correct way inside, and so on. It's a work in progress where a full third of the workers have the strength of a bear and the intelligence and attention span of a third grader, but with an inherent drive to kill, despoil, and desecrate.

Just rambling

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I would love to see this as an article, maybe accompanied by a really cool map made by one of our great artists... Smiling

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'joyblood' wrote:
Anyone interested in detailling that city???

So, kind of like an evil version of Fraggle Rock, right?

If Hymneth decides not to work the place up I will.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

It's all yours, Armoury99. I like to throw ideas out when I can, but realistically I just started Pharmacy School, so anything more indepth than that is pretty unlikely.

I'm still gonna contribute what I can, but I'm probably gonna have to leave the more involved work to others.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Armoury, consider living buildings. Please? Laughing out loud I have developed a soft-spot for building shaped hordelings over the course of the day, even if they are a lot like the Zerg. Maybe include just one, the founder of the town. He was once mobile, but as his evil abated, so too did his mobility. He is now the town's grand hall and meeting spot, giving instructions as both a mayor and a mayor's house.

PS: Smiley no worky. Sad

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I wouldn't make this village as comical as it seems to have been presented so far. I'd want the players to feel genuinely sorry for (and afraid of) the inhabitants as they struggle against their natures. I can see a good plot hook in trying to help this town slide onto the outlands, or at least helping to educate the locals in 'good' practices such as – “don't kill your neighbour if they fall short of our ideal of goodness, otherwise we'll end up in Baator.”

Oh and I think that the occasional Hordling house scattered around the waste is a great idea although I'd see night hags as forcefully merging various Hordlings together to suit their needs rather than relying on the natural ones (who I'd see as being the spirits of twisted care givers - the despairing mother who tucks her children in, kisses them good night, then smothers them with a pillow before slipping poison into her and her husbands nightcap.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I love those ideas... and I'm with you about the "comical" bit. While I think including a piece of comical stuff to lighten up the mood wouldn't hurt, the overall theme of our project IS hopelessness, darkness, evil...

It's called "Of Darkest Gray", after all Eye-wink

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

On a side note:

'Azriael' wrote:
Oh and I think that the occasional Hordling house scattered around the waste is a great idea although I'd see night hags as forcefully merging various Hordlings together to suit their needs rather than relying on the natural ones (who I'd see as being the spirits of twisted care givers - the despairing mother who tucks her children in, kisses them good night, then smothers them with a pillow before slipping poison into her and her husbands nightcap.

I LOVE this.

(I've stopped counting how often I've written this sentence in the last few days. Smiling )

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Speaking of hordlings looking like trees and things. I was recently sketching a few designs I'd been thinking of for a hordling lord that was similar to this concept. It was essentially a great tree that was comprised of a mish mash of eyes, gaping mouths, arms reaching out and a few hideous looking branches that look like melting arms and fingers.

I think I have a few ideas for a hordling building though now. So kudos to the people!!!

As for "hordlingsville" I think that these particular hordling should be definately some of the toughest bashers around. I mean, look at what they have to deal with. Wasting emotion and hope. Yugolotha attacks. Moral crisis. Hag manipulation. Lack of any resources better than their own bodies. Blood war battle fields opening all over the place. Sheer hatred and mistrust from anyone who is even remotely unconnected from the lower planes. Mid life crisis. Family issues. Rising tax rates. World famine. Bad poetry. Relationships. Dance choreography. Betrayal from within. Proper pet care and maintenence. And of course going in day after day with the knowledge that everything they set out to achieve could be gone tommorow. I think they should be good. But very, very xenophobic and perhaps even impolite to anyone outside their walls. Emphasis on the very.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

One idea that I had in my mind, is that there's this legend among Tieflings that generations of inbreeding can result in Hordelings being created...

There's really no proof of this, it's that many Tieflings tend to think of it as a fact. And now even a bunch of humans and other races now believe in the myth that too much inbreeding leads to Hordelings.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Zeniel wrote:

Quote:
Speaking of hordlings looking like trees and things. I was recently sketching a few designs I'd been thinking of for a hordling lord that was similar to this concept. It was essentially a great tree that was comprised of a mish mash of eyes, gaping mouths, arms reaching out and a few hideous looking branches that look like melting arms and fingers.

Iä, Iä, Shub-Niggurath, The Black Goat of The Woods with Thousand Young. Laughing out loud

Good idea. But I just had to chant that, also Idea of tiefling inbreeding is also great one, for Planescape/Mythos horror crossover. I like it. Smiling

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Not to forget, even if it wasn't true originally, with enough belief it can BECOME true...

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

That would explain a lot. I just assumed they couldn't breed without strong magic.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Was Shub-Nuggerath the final boss in quake? Coz thats the impression I get when I think of living trees. Although this thing looks more similar to the elder god in legacy of kain(RIP Tony Jay :cry: ) if it were a tree and had teeth and arms as well as tentacle. Because the roots sorta jut into and around everything.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Well,...

With Night Hags being Neutral Evil, I tend to think of them as the sorts of beings that only take action if they are "interested", they might act out of envy, spite, hatred, curiosity or even a selfish sort of love, but NEVER altruistically. This should be driven home when having any interaction with them.

Examples might include a "favored" being (Hordling, human or whatever) that the Hag for all intents and purposes seems to care for greatly. This creature may seem to have it made from first glance, but the hags affections will involve emotional and possibly physical crippling to "protect" this "beloved pet".

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

An idea that I`m writing into an article for the main site is that hoardlings are basically random variables as far as the loths are concered.

The basic premise is the Baerns are the big nasty masterminds who have everything planed out. After they arrive, the Obyriths and Ancient Baatorians arise from the Abyss and Baator respectively, but nothing comes from the Wastes. Most, including a suprising nuber of Baerns assume that either the Night Hags or the Baerns themselves fulfill the rule of three. They then proceed to create the Yugoloths, Tanar'ri and Baatezu in accordance with `The Plan`, what ever it really is.

Then the Hoardlings arise from the petitioners of the Wastes. And the Baerns didn`t see it come. Hence, the loths are all scared by the potential of the hoardlings, as they could rise to become equal to the Baatorians or Obyriths at the hight of their power, right in the backyard of yugoloths, and potentially destroy thousands to millions of years of planning. The hoardlings aren`t simple, and they aren`t stupid. They are young. And they are still evolving.

Drake

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I like drakes Idea of the hordling being a young new 'loth successors.

However I strongly disagree that its all a plan by the baernaloths and that they orignally created the Tannari and Baatezu. They control them, supposedly, they didn't create them. We can find evidence of this because look what happened to Apomps the exiled baernoloth when he created his chaotic version of 'loths the 'leths. Exile. Plus the story of the baernoloths existence is not even definite fact. Then again in a place where belief is power what is a fact?

Besides what with the 'loths moving into Gehenna and all that I would of assumed that their race is slowly, very slowy becoming too lawful and as such are abandoning the waste to its soon to be new successors, the Hordlings, although the hags'd definatly have to fit in their somewhere.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Quote:
Besides what with the 'loths moving into Gehenna and all that I would of assumed that their race is slowly, very slowy becoming too lawful and as such are abandoning the waste to its soon to be new successors, the Hordlings, although the hags'd definatly have to fit in their somewhere.

I very much doubt it. The 'loths wouldn't have willingly tainted themselves with law or chaos. I think it's much more likely that they thought everything out and things are working the other way around. In a few hundred thousand years, the Ghenna may well shift to the Waste. Or, if not, they would probably have some form of protection from the taint.

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Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

Hey I never said they were tainted unwillingly.
Also Gehenna's only slightly lawful. Plus anyone group or individual living on any plane beyond their original will so find themselves develping certain characteristic from that plane. Remember the planes are more powerful than the fiends combined.

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